Other 1v1 Tournament Policy Discussion Thread

[SuperMemeBroz]

ss2>dpp>sv uu>sv4(lol)

what we had last year is fine in all honesty but I wouldn’t be opposed to a dpp slot, considering sv3 is a jobber slot but ogplhas some real players it seems

 

[Felucia]

SS2 > DPP > SV4 > UU

with 3 SV slots, SS probably has the largest undrafted player pool which means that adding that slot makes a lot of sense for a more exciting draft. I would suggest DPP for similar reasons but during OGPL it became pretty clear that the DPP pool is meager. SV4 and UU I wouldn't recommend, UU lacks development and another SV slot would be spreading the player pool a little too thin to my liking. I really don't understand why people are advocating for UU and SV4 and citing player pool as an argument

 

[Elo Bandit]

DPP > SS2 > UU > SV4

Bring DPP back, we don't need a 4th CG slot. I'm not fully convinced on SVUU, and SS2 is fine but not worth keeping over DPP.

 

[stravench]

DPP > SS2 > UU > SV4

If there should be any changes to the format of PL from last year, I believe having a DPP slot would be the play. With the recent clefable ban, I believe the tier is primed to be played in tours once again. The tier has a lot of room for innovation and I believe having a slot for it in PL would be good. Even if we say there is a chance a team would need to find someone to play DPP, DPP has been easy to build and incoming resources in development I believe would make it easier to build for the tier.

Alternatively, bringing back SS2 would also be good. It has been the common practice before and I believe it is a safe pick overall. There are still a ton of SV players right now that have had experience in SS and I don't think most would be opposed to playing SS.

SVUU is a somewhat fun OM however I am unsure how this will hold up to the player base. The other tiers mentioned above already had success and certain players in that tier yet there is still room for improvements. If SVUU is deemed successful overall and garners enough players that would play this tier over any other tier then it might not be so bad. The lack of resources might be a problem but we are thinking ahead in this case.

SV4 is too excessive. Too much SV already please no. This is not gonna help the metagame a ton compared to when there is already three SV slots. Please no.

 

[bern]

ss2 > sv uu > dpp >>> +2 gigaton hammer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sv4

ss2: i like more old gen appreciation also make ss better Mishlef, ss has more than enough playerbase for 2 slots and it's also cool for old gens to get love so i support it.

sv uu: i have not played a game of sv uu (Mishlef could be focused on making sv uu an actual slot over ss) but if i think it's better than SS and can actually make itself its own little community, then more power to it. also saying uu is not real is like, what.
dpp: no clefable means nuxl isn't going positive jokes aside tho while i'm not against dpp being added i think there isn't enough community support for it, as builders you p much got jamez filipinos lumii rei and eli so i'm not super sure about this one, especially cuz i think rei and lumii are prob sitting this one out

sv4: keep sv4 is getting kicked in the balls, keep it to wc

i'm fine with manager pricing being kept the same as OGPL 2, i think those were fine
no opinion on retains

change

dpp > sv uu

support for dpp has increased a lot and i can see it becoming a slot for PL no problem boblem, plus it helps for an established tier to get meta development, something it otherwise wouldn't get until like what, september? so yeah

 

[LRXC]

Hey everyone, I am here to support SV UU > SS2, DPP, and SV4.

I realize I am not as involved in 1v1 as I once was, but I really think it would be a misstep to extinguish an opportunity to support something new and exciting in the world of 1v1.

I really dislike the notion that a tier has to have a ton of resources, or be "developed" or "established" to have playability. How did people play a metagame when there was no resources? Is that not often the most exciting time in a metagame, especially 1v1 metagames, where you might have a general idea of whats good but can explore and try new things? It's not like SV UU has totally new rules like inverse typing or camomons, I think competitors can look at the available mons, and make new and exciting teams within the same competitive framework as SV 1v1. I think its silly to suggest that this is a negative, in fact I think its a really exciting POSITIVE for a tournament that as many others have suggested, has lost a bit of that excitement, and it does all of this while being a current generation metagame.

 

[Lumii]

My take on this is DPP > SS2 > SV4 > UU. I think that we should be looking at this from a perspective of how easy it would be to field a competitive set of players and look at metrics for managers to see what players are good instead of trying to bash each metagame. I feel that everyone is likely to have much more differing opinions about the state of each metagame, and trying to bash metagames seems somewhat unproductive. Of course I actually play DPP, so take whatever I say with a grain of salt here cause there's going to be some pro-DPP bias here.

DPP is in a pretty decent spot right now. I think that DPP got a pretty good boost in OGPL, with newer players like Nuxl, dreepy, and Slip doing pretty well in the tier. I think that DPP should get enough players between Euphonos, stravench, Jamez, Rei, PA, Nuxl, and dreepy. There's definitely other players, like Elo Bandit, Slip, and I who could definitely play DPP if needed, even though we're likely better in other tiers. Anyways, the playerbase for tiers like BW and ORAS is similarly dire, and I think that non-SS old gens having this sort of issue while trying to field a single slot in PL is not a completely new thing.

SS2 seems incredibly close to DPP to me, but I'm only putting it slightly behind. I think that like DPP, it's incredibly possible to field a good set of players here. The reason I have it behind DPP is that I think OGPL showed one of the bigger issue with the SS2 slot, which is that there's a lot less experience in potential SS2 players than DPP players. I also think that the addition of three SV slots would affect the SS2 player pool more than the DPP player pool, which is why I think it's a slightly worse option.

SV4 is where I think we have a pretty massive drop-off here. I do not think that we have the SV playerbase to support a fourth SV slot, and think that World Cup VII showed us a good example of this. Of course, PL is a totally different beast, but the fact is that SV4 dilutes an already somewhat underwhelming SV3 pool. I think it's definitely a weaker option than DPP and SS2, but I think that it's at least been tested, making it better than UU, given that managers would at least have some sort of data to go off of when trying to figure out who to select for a potential SV4 slot.

UU is the worst option to me at this moment but I can definitely see having a UU slot in future tournaments. There has been zero tournament representation so far for UU, with UU's first tournament currently being in signups. The biggest issue with this will be the sheer lack of data that managers will have to go off of in order to make draft plans in SV UU. It might be very possible to find a playerbase for UU, but in almost every case, the players would be better in another slot. I can see UU getting a slot in something like World Cup if it develops well from here, but I think that it is not ready for PL representation yet due to overall just being too new.

 

[Itchy]

Slots: idrc about the balance between gens or whether DPP gets in. UU is brand new and axing anything to get it in is just bending to the hype train imo, there isn't the playerbase, resources, or knowledge to have it be a competitive pool, it's quite literally a few weeks old at most. The current old gens don't have slotting issues, UU will. Don't consider it. Maybe next PL.

Manager prices: voting has flaws, but I think they're overblown. I've enjoyed flat pricing scheme tours for other things like ompl / umpl. either works. formulas are wack but can be fine too. doesn't matter too much.

everything else: /shrug

 

[DEG]

Personal opinion; no preference between SS2/SV4/DPP, I just don't think UU is ready at all.

I don't believe UU is ready at all for an appearance in the "most competitive" tournament in 1v1. It's a new metagame that is born cause people were bored of our SV and it just has a long hype train behind it cause new toy. Listen, I would love to have UU, I was the one that introduced UU to PLs (in SM) and people didn't like it back so I had to sadly remove it (not saying the same will happen, just random old people lore).

I have a problem with how UU is structured rn. I'm not really convinced about the whole usage thing behind UU atm, there's also discussions about a "future" change to percentage and whatever, I don't believe a temporary metagame that doesn't consistently get updated should be in PL. There should be discussions and trials to nail the correct percentage when it comes to UU because a random "top 60" isn't really it. It's also hosting its first tournament only around 1.5 months before the draft, which is not enough time for figuring out what's happening, and tiering. I don't think we should introduce an untiered metagame in PL. + it's literally new, and people are just hyped cause their friends are playing it, I don't see a discord tournament as a proof that it's popular, we don't know how interested the community is playing it, we don't know if anything is broken, we don't know if there's going to be resources, we don't know which gen pool is going to get "weaker" for UU, it's a big leap into the unknown and that shouldn't happen in PL at all. Let's talk UU when there's actually concrete evidence that it's a tier that is here to stay (hype beyond a few months, resources, smogon tournaments, consistency in usage stats, and tiering)

Also formulaprice/flat price for managers, no more voting cause not sustainable+low trust after past tournaments.

team should start w/ 3 players by max

 

[SuperMemeBroz]

In hindsight I’ve realized there is no real reason to give a fuck on what format people want, y’all just gonna use that slot to throw in some jobber (maybe besides UU), y’all saw what happened with MG”

Then into its lifespan, you all decided it was too Mickey and slotted in some goombas and passed them used teams and hope they did well. (In reality you guys wanted every excuse in the world to get rid of DPP but 2 years later you guys are contemplating on bringing it back)


Because I’m a shithead, here’s what I think is gonna happen if one of the 4 slots gets out in

DPP: You find out something was secretly broken this entire time and the council decides to ban it (or not) and people end up hating dpp again

SV UU: Like multigen, people are interested but gets turned into a jobber slot

SV4: If SV3 is Mickey then SV4 was made for babies

SS2: Council is run by a bunch of stubborn people who acknowledge the shortcomings of the metagame but never actually do anything about it to try to improve the tier which then translates to a bunch of people expressing their distaste in the tier which makes less people want to play it overall which equates to less people wanting to go play it in the tournament

At the end of day, no one is going to universally agree on which tier is best, if you want to be safe, go ss2, if you want to be inclusive, go dpp, if you want to actually be unique with your tournament, go sv uu, if you want to be actually brain dead, go sv4, I can’t say there’s an objective right answer (however choosing sv4 is being objectively brain dead)

Holy, now that I’m looking at it with my old shitty take and the fact I said ss2 was the best option makes me want to jump off a bridge. But now I don’t really care what gets voted on atp as long as it isn’t sv4

 

[crow crumbs]

SS2: Council is run by a bunch of stubborn people who acknowledge the shortcomings of the metagame but never actually do anything about it to try to improve the tier which then translates to a bunch of people expressing their distaste in the tier which makes less people want to play it overall which equates to less people wanting to go play it in the tournament

Name them

 

[Euphonos]

DPP > [SS2/SV4] > SV UU

It may be early for me to judge, but I do think SV UU would be Multigen incarnate in the long term as what SuperMemeBroz mentioned: overhyped and unsustainable.

Of course, as the leader of the DPP 1v1 metagame, I'd be way biased to vouch for this forsaken metagame after it was being axed in PL two years ago; I think the metagame is now in a better place than it was before, especially with its development being more active. It's high time to bring back this metagame to its former glory (for PL and probably WC for that matter!)

I'd be indifferent about SS2 and SV4 if DPP weren't selected, but here's to hoping the support for DPP is more than enough to reclaim its spot in major team tournament settings.